Barna’s statistics recently came out about giving trends over the past year. I just recently posted my thoughts about that as well. Here is the question, Why is giving down? Is it because of a bad economy? Is it because of gas prices? Is it because pastors aren’t preaching tithing enough? Probably due to the backlash against tithing, i’m sure pastors are preaching more about tithing. they have to keep up with the grandeur religious empires. After all it’s all about building the kingdom of ?_______?
Tithing is a simple solution for stewardship in a church. All a pastor has to do is make sure his people know they are required to tithe, and then increase the number of people. Viola! you have your church a steady budget to grow with. It’s very easy. The more people, the more offering you get. If people start questioning the use of the money, just make them happy with free coffee and donuts for a week or two. I think i’ll make a blog post about how to fool people into giving more money. Anyways, so all that a pastor has to do is make sure his people know that tithing is important to your relationship with God, and then make sure that you have lots of people. On the other hand, if you had Spirit-led giving, you couldn’t get away with that. A pastor would need to make sure that his people are in a right and full relationship with God. Once they were in that position, then the giving would follow suit. Not only that it verifies that the church leadership is going in a direction that the people are being called by the Spirit to pay for.
So why is giving down? Maybe it’s because pastors are less concerned with the relationship that their congregation has with God and are more concerned with keeping their empire flourished. I don’t know. For those of you out there, that are just gritting your teeth about my attitude towards pastors, just take a deep breath, because i greatly recognize that many pastors have kept their church on the right track.
Why should it matter that the economy is bad or that gas is $5 a gallon. If the people of God are right with God then why should our giving struggle?
Ken says
Sometimes the giving bypasses the collection plate and goes straight to the receiver. It irked my former paster when I would ask him if there were any financial needs in the body that I could contribute to and I was instructed to just put it in the offering plate and the church would make sure it got to the right person. I did that the first time just to learn that the person who needed the help never got it. So had I followed the Spirit and gave it directly to the need, they would have seen God at work through his people, one oerson at a time.
Jared Brian says
Good comment ken,
I had just made a statement the other day that was along the lines of what you have said. The Holy Spirit is living and breathing in you, not just the deacons that allocate your church’s budget. Don’t promote thoughtless giving through an automated tithe. Promote Spiritual maturity through Spirit-guided giving.
freewillgiver says
I gave to a bum yesterday outside of a Win co foods. I don’t know how he will spend the change that I gave him but I said “Jesus loves you!”. Everytime I give to a homless person or when I give a tip I try to remember to say the name of Jesus to the reciever of my gift. I gave a plummer 30 dollars for doing some off the books work on my sink. He said you don’t have to pay me and I said This is from Jesus. I feel that Christians should say the name of Jesus more often so that people will know who to thank for Christian generosity. Folks would associate Jesus with Charity. Even if Bums and my plumber mismanage my money they know who it comes from-Jesus. The name of Jesus is lifted up better in my opinion when Christians use their imagination while giving.
Mike says
Christian’s are more afraid of the IRS than they are of God ! They don’t tithe because God ‘can’t make ‘ them. They are disobedient , unholy , and robbers.
A non tither has an issue with God NOT with their Pastor.
Suzie says
If Mike is around I hope he reads these scriptures prayerfully and learn the meaning of Grace (unearned favor) and discover what Christ meant after he said Paid in full on his Cross. Give glory to the payment Jesus made, not our own, unless you are a Jew living under the law of the Old Covenant! (NOT)!
2nd Corinthian 9:77Every man according as he (purposes) decides in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loves a cheerful giver.
Galatians 5:4Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.
Galatians 3:24Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.Galatians 3:25But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
Galatians 3:13Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
Jared Brian says
Mike. . . Mike. . . Mike. . . (sigh),
What makes you think that God is happy with 10%? What makes you think that pastors devouring widows houses and forcing them to tithe is holy?
Mike says
Caring for widows and orphans from those tithes is also Biblical. Not to care for these people is non-Biblical. ‘Devouring widows houses’ ? I am sorry that a pastor somewhere let you down but we must stick with the Bible.
Jesus taught tithing. Mt 23:23
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
Lu 11:42 But woe unto you, Pharisees! for ye tithe mint and rue and all manner of herbs, and pass over judgment and the love of God: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
We are to tithe. This is an OT and NT truth. We are also to give offerings – thus we give God more than ‘10%’. A proper understanding of tithing begins with the fact that ALL 100% belongs to God. As a steward we are to oversee EVERYTHING God has given to us.
Toddo says
I have to respond to Mike. Your attitude is a perfect example of the kind of OT style legalism that has infected the NT church since the 6th century. Prior to that, the early Church gave their money, not to building projects, staff salaries, etc., but to aid the poor and the widows.
Perhaps you might want to go to the website: shouldthechurchteachtithing.com to discover what God teaches the NT church regarding our finances. Allow God to fill your heart with grace, rather than judgment and condemnation.
Donald says
If giving was done in the NT manner of the 2nd Corithians chapters 8 & 9 passages, which is grace giving or giving in the age of grace, I don’t believe giving would be down at at all.
Mike
Those passages are Jesus’ rebuke of the Pharisees’ self-righteouness not instructions for tithing.
That is legalism.
Those are weak proof-texts in isolation for the purpose of building a doctrine tithing from the New Testament.
No honest expositor or student of scripture can look objectively at a single New Testament passage or text of scripture, and pull tithing out from their.
Mike says
I just love all this talk about LEGALISM. You ‘ Bible Experts’ don’t even know what LEGALISM is.
By definition : Legalism is a religious system of good works whereby a person hopes ot obtain salvation. Legalism is follwing the law in order to be saved.
Next time you thorw legalism around use it is context.
By the way – all you GRACE GIVERS…
Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord. Grace is an OT/NT truth. You people make me laugh with your lack of understanding. You start with the belief that tithing is wrong and then twist truth to justify your sin.
By the way – I’d love to see your GRACE GIVING record just once. Not only would I guess that your NOT tithing – I would venture to say that your not GRACE GIVING either.
God Bless you wonderful know it all !
Mike says
I CORRECTED MY SPELLING ON THIS ONE BEFORE YOU ATTACK ME ON THAT ALSO !
I just love all this talk about LEGALISM. You ‘ Bible Experts’ don’t even know what LEGALISM is.
By definition : Legalism is a religious system of good works whereby a person hopes to obtain salvation. Legalism is follwing the law in order to be saved.
Next time you throw legalism around use it is context.
By the way – all you GRACE GIVERS…
Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord. Grace is an OT/NT truth. You people make me laugh with your lack of understanding. You start with the belief that tithing is wrong and then twist truth to justify your sin.
By the way – I’d love to see your GRACE GIVING record just once. Not only would I guess that your NOT tithing – I would venture to say that your not GRACE GIVING either.
God Bless you wonderful know it alls !
Toddo says
Mike…such vitriol in your tone! Forgive me if I responded to you in that way.
A couple of points:
I started with the desire to learn what the Bible says about stewardship. After much study God revealed to me through His word that the mandatory payment of a tithe is not binding on the Church. You are incorrect to assume that I (and perhaps others) BEGAN with the premise that tithing is not for today.
You are also incorrect to assume that I do not give 10%- in fact I give more that a tenth, though I am not obligated by the Scripture to do so. I do it voluntarily and cheerfully. THAT’s Biblical!
I am certainly no “bible expert”, just a sincere follower of Christ. However, there are many true Bible scholars/theologians who have reached the same conclusion regarding tithing.
Regarding grace, I know that I could have fellowship with you as a believer, even with your view on tithing. Could you do the same? If not, you need to evaluate if you are capable of extending grace to others.
Blessings.
Toddo
Melissa says
Maybe…it’s as simple as God’s people live in a world where unemployment has risen. The unemployed can’t give…even if they believe they should.
Glenn says
As a Pastor that loves Gods Church I feel it is so sad when Christians fight over an issue that should unite us not divide. Giving is a form of worship to God, who can forget the words of Jesus about the old widow with a couple of pennies.
It is very simple and this is what we teach our church:
1/ Be a cheerful giver with a good heart.
2/ Tithing is a God given pricipal that we can choose to use in our giving but we are no longer under the law of tithing.
3/ Know way in the NT does it say tithing is wrong.
I would say to both camps on this issue please don’t teach or make out the NT teaches Yes or No on tithing, instead show the maturity we should all show to one another that if one chooses to tithe thats OK, if one chooses not to, then make sure your giving is still from the heart.
Jared Brian says
Glenn,
you misunderstand the issue at hand here. No one is bothered that people are giving 10% of their income. Just like no one is bothered that people are still being circumcised. The problem is the enforcement of tithing on people. As long as tithing is enforced on people, then i will fight back against it.
I am not standing up for my cause. This is the word of God i’m standing up for. You said it yourself, ‘we are no longer under the law of tithing’ and yet you have no backbone to stand up against those who rob widow’s houses. Maybe that’s not a cause worthy enough to stand up for. I don’t know, why don’t you see the response of Jesus in Matthew 23.
-jared
Toddo says
It grieves me that so many (most) churches REQUIRE tithing to become a member and to be accepted into the local church. I know of a number of churches in my area that require believers to sign a card vowing to tithe…such coercion! Giving of any amount that doesn’t cheerfully come from the heart is not pleasing in the eyes of God
Kelly says
Galations 5:24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires. Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with te Spirit. Let us not become conceited, provoking, and envying each other.
All of us who have posted here appear to be part of the church; that is the body of Christ (no matter what church building or congregation you might be associated with). These words apply to us. The whole world can see this string of comments and this is what non-believers see when they look at the body of Christ. Do you think Jesus would realy use terms like “vitriol in your tone” or “You ‘ Bible Experts’” to make a case for what one should be giving to God?
Each person should pray and seek what God would have him do. Jesus told a ruler in Luke 18:22 to sell everything and give it to the poor. Then in Luke 21:34 a widow’s offering was considered “more than all the others” with her two very small copper coins.
When I started attending a church, I did not feel I had enough to give, but I found over the first few years there that I was limiting what God could do through me by that thinking. Now I give more than 10% to my church AND I give to those in need around me and I have seen my income (or God’s that he lets me use) increase over that period of time, even in this poor economy.
It’s not the economy, our thology, statistics or our church leaders that should dictate what should be given to God and where it should be spent. It the Holy Spirit that lives within us all and speaks to us each individually as to what God’s will is for us, but remember…God doesn’t contradict Himself, so whatever He’s telling you…it has to line up wih scripture OT AND NT. So pray, study, and then take it to action!
Blessings
Toddo says
Kelly,
Thanks for your thoughts on financial giving- they echo the opinions of many believers, myself included. Our giving is truly “whatever you purpose in your heart to do”.
I do take one small issue with you, however, When a church requires a tithe from it’s members, declaring it to be a scriptural mandate, that must be firmly resisted. It is simply NOT SCRIPTURAL! That is, tithing is NOT required for the NT church.
If you notice, the judgmental attitude has come from the pro-tithe camp in this thread. Jesus called the legalists of His time “a brood of vipers”, and overturned the tables of those who would profit from the worship of God. The only people Jesus strongly confronted were the religious who forced laws upon the faithful that went beyond what God required.
I have no problem with christians tithing- just don’t try to force that opinion on the rest of us! God will lead.
Blessings,
Toddo
Melissa says
Toddo,
Please read Matthew 23:23, where Jesus himself speaks on tithing.
Melissa
Toddo says
Hi Melissa,
If you are referring to Jesus’ words to the Pharisees (I don’t have my Bible in front of me), me must put this in it’s historical context. Jesus was speaking to men UNDER THE MOSAIC LAW. Of course they were expected to tithe of their spices- the fruit of the land.
We are not under that law anymore. Both the ceremonial as well as the civic law (which tithing was a part of) has been done away with- fulfilled in Christ. The NT instruction concerning stewardship is quite detailed, but there is no mandate for believers to continue- or preachers to require- the practice of tithing.
Blessings.
Toddo
freewillgiver says
Thank you Toddo
Toddo Please come on over to the blog and make a post there from time to time and tell a friend.